Liverpool banter 10

14 Oct 2026 15:46:21
One for the Eds, and one that reminds me how much we miss Ed002 as he would've known this off the top of his head!

Why do lower table teams find it easier to get work permits for foreign players, especially from outside of Europe?

A couple of thoughts I have are to do with wage bills, and playing HG players.

I'm sure I read somewhere that we only had 1 available 'special' work permit and Ndiaye already had been allocated it so Ndukwe had to go on loan.

I would imagine that lower table teams probably have a far higher percentage of HG players and therefore would qualify for more of these special category WPs than we would.

Also, can't remember if there's something to do with wages for the new arrival and whether they represent a certain %age of our wageroll?

But I wonder if one of you would have more of a definitive idea?

{Ed001's Note - the HG players and special work permits certainly does help but the main thing is the wages. To get the permit, you have to reach a points threshold, which is made up of a number of things, such as international caps (and the level of the country they are earnt for affects the number of points). The easiest way to get the points is to put the player in the top bracket of earners, which is again easier at a club like Brighton than at Liverpool. It is almost impossible to get enough points for a player without recent international appearances unless you can pay them in the top bracket. That is when you would turn to a 'special' work permit, but that is a problem for us now.}

14 Oct 2026 16:16:45
Thanks for that Ed001, yes the wages as you explain makes a lot of sense. When we've got so many earners on £200k+ we'd have to pay a player a helluva lot of money to get into the highest earners bracket.

I guess that's where multi-club models come in useful, where you own a smaller club too where a player can build up points and maybe get into the international squad enough to then move to the larger club.

{Ed001's Note - spot on mate, that is exactly what they are used for, as well as money laundering and fudging transfer fees etc. We would need to pay over 300k, I believe, due to Virgil's wage. There is no way we would do that for an unknown youngster.}

14 Oct 2026 16:42:32
Great explanation, Ed - it certainly clears up a lot.
I did have one question about how we signed Leoni, though. Obviously no one can be expected to know the specifics, but would he likely be on the special work permit?

{Ed001's Note - yes.

14 Oct 2026 12:04:41
On the Wirtz topic my concern is we repeat the mistake Chelsea made with Salah and De Bruyne. Players that didn't settle in a new Country with the big club when they were 21-23 and had to leave. Only to return a couple of years later for another club and become legends.

Wirtz is in that age bracket now and his confidence is shot. For him the best thing may well be to leave but I'd hate to see another club flourish with him down the road.

14 Oct 2026 12:18:35
Salah and De Bruyne were not starters for Chelsea, and were never given a chance due to Mourinho's preference for ready made stars, rather than developing a project. Wirtz has been a starter from the get go and underdelivered for over a year now. There is a stark difference.

I swear I have never known a player to require so much for him to operate. Wirtz needs fast wingers to operate, we got it. Wirtz needs a striker with fast movement, we got that with Isak. Wirtz needs Ekitike to operate due to their quick exchanges, we have that. Wirtz needs to be rid of Slot and he will flourish, we got that. Wirtz needs to be given the freedom of the CAM role to operate, not be used at LW, we got that now with how Iraola utilises him. Wirtz needs someone like Klopp to put his arm around him and guide him, we have that. Wirtz needs to receive the ball more, we do that and he missplaces the most simplest of passes.

How much more does this man need!? Like, seriously. Never in all my years have I heard so many excuses for a player, regardless of his price. A 100 million plus should be able to elevate all those around him, not require additional 100 plus million players to operate at a high level. It is utterly ridiculous.

14 Oct 2026 12:22:45
Jon, that's the risk you take in giving up on players way too early out of impatience because they are not panning out quick enuff for you, regardless of how much you pay for them.

Esp. if after they are gone, the players start to to flourish elsewhere and the selling club starts to struggle. Chelsea suffered, as well.

Remember had we gotten rid of Hendo after one season, we wouldn't have had him leading us to glory for years under Klopp.

Essentially, be careful of what you wish for.

14 Oct 2026 12:45:43
Wirtz must go. he can't tackle.

14 Oct 2026 12:56:40
Henderson didn't join us with the expectation of Wirtz. Wirtz joined us as "the next generational talent". Up till now he's come nowhere near to living up to that. He has the remainder of this season to prove his worth.

14 Oct 2026 13:04:48
I think the reason there is a lot of support for Wirtz is partly because he works hard despite his obvious lack of confidence/quality atm. And because people know there is a world class player in there. He was the main man at Leverkusen and beautiful to watch. People want to see that and some still have hope that it can happen. He has been massively disappointing so far. Though I don't agree with people who say he's been crap since he came.

He has had moments namely last season before his injury and many moments in games where he has shown flashes of brilliance. i'm not ready to give up on him coming good yet because if he does and it looks like a big if as we stand he will absolutely light the Premier League up. At his best he is the type of footballer that makes his teammates better and makes football a more beautiful thing to watch.

14 Oct 2026 13:51:53
Truly @MANGO. I think we all want him to succeed and can't accept he just might not that's the reason for the many excuses.

If there's no major improvement by the end of the season, then we should be looking to sell in my opinion.

@OliRed, maybe we would have had someone else. Who knows? Besides Hendo didn't come with a lofty price tag so the expectation was much less.

We sold Coutinho and it wasn't the end of the world. In fact, we became better as a team.

We have been worse off since Wirtz joined the team. Of cause I am not saying he is solely to blame for our decline since winning the league as there are other factors as well. However, selling him wouldn't be the end of Liverpool. We might just be better for it.

14 Oct 2026 14:59:47
De Bruyne and Salah never played. Wirtz has played 60 games for us starting nearly all of them. Has till the end of the season to turn it around I'd imagine.

14 Oct 2026 17:23:31
I'd like to know if wirtz is working on weak areas in his game, extra training ect. I know he's put on more muscle when playing under slot. Eds1 says he needs more movement ahead of him but if we haven't got the players ahead to do that then adapt his game and try and make it work before it's too late and sold.

14 Oct 2026 11:55:58
I presume we can't appeal against the Gravenberch sending off as it was as a result of 2 yellows, and yellow cards can't be appealed?

14 Oct 2026 12:14:52
We wouldn't win anyway, it'd be a wasted appeal, just take the 1 match ban and move on.

14 Oct 2026 12:23:31
It's only one game. We can survive.

14 Oct 2026 13:03:42
Fair enough. Just caught the article on Struijk's ban being overturned and hoped! He was back to his old form for 60 mins so it'd be ideal to have him available for the next game.

14 Oct 2026 10:05:42
Won't be an easy game tonight with all the injuries. Some of the starters from Sunday will also need to be taken out if they are needed to start again the weekend. Big night for the likes of Nyoni and Ngumoha who should both start.

14 Oct 2026 12:01:57
I'm hoping we go strong. I think we have more chance of winning this (CL)than the PL. That's probably an obvious statement to make, I know.

14 Oct 2026 13:51:35
I think we will see a few fringe players starting from the likes of Gomez, Tsimikas, Frimpong, Nyoni and Rio. I assume we will have to keep Koumas up top unless we go with somebody like Barcola or Wirtz through the middle.

14 Oct 2026 15:05:19
Agree with Rome.
Hope we go fairly strong - get the points on the board early and a good win under our belts before a massive game for us on the weekend.
Confidence needs a boost.

14 Oct 2026 10:52:00
Hello all, I know this is unlikely to happen but I would love to see PL teams (especially those with limited squads) field weakened teams against the cheaters - the logic being that they believe any result against them will be nullified anyway.

It would highlight the depth of feeling against the cheaters. There is no way the PL would dare to punish those teams that did that.

14 Oct 2026 11:11:01
They would though, its almost match fixing what you suggest. Plus todays team in theory has nothing to do with the Team from 2009-2018 even though we all know they're probably still cheating their arses off to cook the books.

14 Oct 2026 11:41:48
Arne, we really can't say because the period post 2018 has not been investigated. And given the nonchalant arrogance of ManCheats management, I wouldn't be the least surprised if it is found to have continued since 2018.

{Ed001's Note - you can say because the finances showed the same income as when they were topping it up by over 100m. If they stopped cheating, their income would have dropped.}

14 Oct 2026 12:17:20
Now that is a very simple but most accurate assessment ED01. So obvious really!

14 Oct 2026 13:36:07
In by-gone years, teams were punished for playing what the PL called a 'weakened team' but as we've moved on with what's the point in having a squad? As long as they're in your 25.
They're no longer considered a 'weakened team.'.

14 Oct 2026 12:57:57
Ed, I saw somewhere that the income has dropped. Not saying it is true, though because there is no proof of that either. What do you think on this?

{Ed001's Note - the only time income dropped was during Covid and then nothing like 100m.}

14 Oct 2026 15:48:37
Very valid point Ed001. I hadn't thought of that. Do you think they will look at post 2018 or slide it under the rug along with announcement of penalties and punishments for the previous period?

{Ed001's Note - they are being pushed into looking at it, but so far they have failed to do so. I am not sure why, they should have started a separate investigation into each year following 2018 at the same time as the original one was started. Clearly they are reluctant to do so as they don't want people to know who riddled with corruption and cheating the game is, hence why they regularly have clubs report failed drugs tests as injuries. At one point a few years ago, it was revealed that there were over 20 players throughout the English pyramid serving drugs bans that were being reported as long term injuries.

I think they fear the collapse cycling initially had after Lance Armstrong was caught. Not in terms of the fans turning the TV off, but the sponsors that withdrew cost that sport huge amounts of money, I think they fear similar happening to the Prem.}

14 Oct 2026 16:06:29
My biggest fear is that they will allow politics to play a part in the scale of punishments that are handed out. The PL is dealing with a state, not just a team from an English city. The amount of humiliation and loss of face for that state would be colossal and they are acutely sensitive to that.

14 Oct 2026 16:20:58
In response to your reply, Ed001, do you think this is a bigger scandal than the Italian "Calciopoli"?

{Ed001's Note - yes, because it involves outright buying off officials such as Oliver, while Calciopoli just worked to get favourable officials appointed to the matches. This is also got to involve the entire ADUG group of clubs, which is worldwide, so much bigger than just the Premier League.}

14 Oct 2026 19:20:39
Some coutries didn't even do any steroid testing at all (Spain in 2016 did not conduct a single urine or steroid blood test all year) some countries have their testing license revoked multiple times after wada found their testing to to be inconsistent (Qatar, UAE and Saudi have all had this happen)

Even in the Premier League man city were twice fined for missing dope tests citing new protocols as the reason for missing it, ironically the exact same excuse pep used when some of his Barca players skipped drugs testing as well.

It's funny how the only league which made pep stick to the rules (bundesliga) is also the only place pep really struggle to dominate as expected and his team actually regressed. Interestingly pep repeatedly blamed his teams poor performances in Germany on the team doctor and insisted if he'd been allowed to bring his doctor from Barca (a dude who got pep banned for steroids as a player) then they would have won a lot more.

Doping is a far bigger issue than people realise and a lot of players get protected by their FA to protect the income of the league. This is why I find it funny that série a is labelled so negatively when it's the only league who publicly pursues and punishes cheaters repeatedly.

13 Oct 2026 20:52:38
Ed1 how do you see the future of the club and team panning out?

Do you reckon FSG will sell up next year or hold off to see what happens with City first for suing?

If the consortium take control do you think we will have a clear out and return to finding hidden gems / players iraolo wants and can improve instead of the unbalanced squad we have just now?

{Ed001's Note - if the consortium want it, then FSG will sell up. I have no idea how they will run the club though, I am not even sure who is involved fully. It will come down to who actually is in control.}

13 Oct 2026 23:46:56
I've heard QPR fans say really positive things about Amit Bhatia. It was a tricky time with a lot of competing interests at the board level, but he was seen as the only adult in that room by a lot of people passionate about QPR, so I do have reasonably high hopes for him. As Ed points out it will all come down to who is actually in charge.

I don't think anyone can say with real certainty what their recruitment strategy would be if they do take control as we've heard very little from them; understandable as I don't think the regulatory process has concluded yet. We might hear more when that is finalised.

13 Oct 2026 16:37:05
I expected Man Cheateh to get a lenient punishment because of the power of their lawyers and money.
Now there is a connection to the PM from the owners and house building projects in Manchester. (Where is that you may ask? Good question!)

I have had enough of these corrupt cheats. It has gone too far. The super soft yellow card on Gravenberch on Sunday made me very suspicious. It was from a referee actually from Manchester. Move along now nothing to see here.

If the FA do not exact a serious punishment, and I mean serious punishment on Man Cheaty. The Premier League is in a certain chance of disruption and loss of faith. Rival supporters all need to make their feelings known in no uncertain terms.

13 Oct 2026 17:56:18
I seen a stat yesterday 1 Scouse ref in prem and 3 manc, apparently the Scouse ref has reffed 0 lfc/efc games the manc refs have reffed 212 utd/city games.

13 Oct 2026 17:59:47
What Dya expect. Howard Webb runs it and he's the biggest Cheating Manc of all time.

13 Oct 2026 18:32:48
I dunno. I am forever suspicious of claims that a system has been rigged, probably because I found Trump's claims about his election defeat to be mad, bad, and dangerous.

I think Kavanagh just had a bad day at the office. I bet the last thing he wanted to do was send off an LFC player in that atmosphere: but he messed up by giving a really stupid first yellow for Grav, and then had his hands tied for the second (which did warrant a yellow).

13 Oct 2026 19:56:23
Many were skeptical when Klopp called out Coote. If you watch a lot of footy and you notice certain referees consistently 'make' dodgy decisions against your team, I think you need to trust what your observe.

13 Oct 2026 20:05:14
Kavanagh is bent as a nine pound note. As for Oliver, the fact he was given £20k by Man City's owners in plain sight should have been enough to end his career. Same as that other PoS Darren England. We knew Coote was crooked and we were proven right.

13 Oct 2026 20:45:47
@Monster, Mansour lives in the real world where they can exercise power and real influence to achieve what they want through financial power. Trump can't tell the difference between Greenland and Iceland.

14 Oct 2026 09:24:45
Refereeing corruption happened in Serie A with massive ramifications, it's currently being formally investigated in La Liga. The only reason we somehow think we're immune to it England is because the client journalists tell us it's just a mad conspiracy because that's what they're ordered to print in order to protect the Premier League "product". It's clear as day.

14 Oct 2026 13:06:34
Monster, remember what Klopp said after we won the League Cup vs Chelsea in 2024 and he did not shake hands with the ref at the time.

He was then asked why he didn't shake his hand and he said that "The ref was not at the level"? What ref was that? Chris Kavanaugh.

Also, we said Coote was bent and everyone laughed at us for being cray babies, like VV said. Are they laughing now? And I don't believe for a second that he is the only one. No way in hell

At the end of the day, we have to stop ignoring what your eyes and ears are seeing/hearing and essentially, we should stop ignoring what we are living in real time. There are 3/4 refs (Kavanaugh, Oliver, England and prolly, Tierney and Atwell) who have it in for Liverpool and there is way too much evidence to just ignore as just "another bad day at the office".

This stuff is real and Sunday esp. with how blatant the injustice was and with how huge the game was, i'm out of F's to give to the whole "just a bad day in the office" stuff.

14 Oct 2026 13:42:24
Not sure why trump features so regularly on a EPL transfer rumours page.
If you actually look at what went on over there and not just listen to the BBC like national anthem booing socialist shidiots, you might be in danger of using your own critical thinking and form a genuine opinion of your own.

Anyone who actually looks into that period of history would reasonably conclude that there was in fact cheating. Cheating that is still going on today and not just limited to over there either.

Besos out.

13 Oct 2026 15:35:06
After watching the city game and the terrible card issues, and subsequently listening to the explanations both for and against,
Apparently the feeling among refs is that the standard for a second yellow should be higher, as a sending off dramatically alters a game giving one side a large advantage.( it can even things up if it numerically helps the weaker tireder team)
Imo sin bin system would be fairer as it gives the offending team a chance to get back in the game.


Currently multiple yellows to a player benefits a different team in the future.
Seems to work in many other sports.
As a side note personally I'd sack the current crop of refs and replace them with Rugby refs as they seem to be able to read and implement the rules whilst commanding respect.

13 Oct 2026 16:36:31
There is nothing wrong with the card system the problem is the rules and or the application of the rules.

A red charge should be for repeat offences
Denying a goal scoring opportunity
Serious foul play / violent conduct.

It isn't hard, the problem is the threshold for getting bookings is too easy and the application of the law is too inconsistent.

13 Oct 2026 17:25:53
Roy Keane on Ryan Gravenberch's Red Card Against Manchester City;

"Listen, I'm sitting here absolutely flabbergasted by what I've just witnessed. We are talking about Liverpool versus Manchester City at Anfield. This isn't a pre-season kick-around, this isn't a mid-table dead-rubber—this is as big as it gets in world football. You've got millions watching around the globe, two top-class teams going toe-to-toe, and the entire match gets ruined because the officials want to be the main event.

Look at the match context! Ryan Gravenberch was having one of his absolute best games in a Liverpool shirt. He's driving through the midfield, he's testing Gianluigi Donnarumma with a cracking strike from range, and then literally seconds later, he makes a recovery challenge in the City half on Jérémy Doku. Was it a foul? Yeah, fine, give a free-kick. But to whip out a second yellow card in the 62nd minute for that? It is an absolute disgrace.

13 Oct 2026 17:50:30
Gravenberch red was an awful decision and it ruined the game. What's going under the radar is that's 2 games in a row they've had these decisions go their way and played 10 men after Fernades was sent off at old Trafford for that nothing event with Foden.

13 Oct 2026 17:59:09
Wasn't it Foden who got sent off, JK?

13 Oct 2026 18:12:56
Foreign referees at the end of this season must be tried, get rid of the Coward Webb poisonous "clicks" PGMOL for ever.

Sin Bins for red cards and the system what's in place for Rugby Union where five independent experts decide during the game, if it is a fair red card dismissal, or just a time out in a sin bin, the game may indeed be over, but at least he is not suspended for the next game. Coward Webb has not apologised on behalf of the ref, so he must agree with the referees overall performance, i. e. imaginary red cards etc

Roy Keane failed to mention football is in fact a "contact sport" i. e. Van de Ven tackle on Isak resulting in a broken leg, no card issued?
Roy Keane also failed to mention man United have played against ten men in their last two matches, one point from 6, which is par for them with Car wreck at the wheel? city got the rub of the green also in the mancheaty derby fernandez not interfering with play, when attempting a diving header?

YNWA Andoni

YNWA Andoni.

13 Oct 2026 18:14:25
JK experiencing the Mandela Effect.

13 Oct 2026 18:39:45
Surely not Rome that would go against the narrative.

And if City were reduced to 10 men why didn't they capitulate.

13 Oct 2026 19:08:48

It's them pesky cheating b******* at it again, JK.

13 Oct 2026 21:11:08
The sooner that they replace human refs with robots the better.
As long as they are all programmed the same, at least we will get consistent decisions.

14 Oct 2026 09:26:46
Until we have a serious conversation about the corruption within PGMOL we'll be sat here being nonplussed by decisions and arguing about interpretations of the rules every week until Dermot Gallagher grows his hair back.

14 Oct 2026 13:12:45
Mcgoveb, Roy Keane is literally all of us. or all of us who care about actual justice and fairness. The man said everything many of us were saying and seeing.

Anderson got MOTM. The guy was eating Grav's dust all game. Enzo went missing and Grav was the best player on the pitch by a mile. And suddenly, you give a yellow card for a challenge like that 70 yards from goal? It just looked so unfair that Grav got the second yellow because City were not in the game at all up until then.

It felt like the ref did that just to "even things out" which he should not be doing. It was awful and mad annoying and unjust.

13 Oct 2026 15:09:56
I think the game against Lask will be a signal of how well Iraola can manage the squad playing in multiple competitions.

He isn't experienced competing on all fronts including in the champions league, and it's not easy.

The game against Brentford next weekend is massive. With only two wins in the Premier League this season out of six, it's a must-win in my opinion, and they are a decent side in good form.

LASK should be beatable with a rotated team and previous seasons in the new format have shown us that finishing high up in the league phase is not necessarily a positive indicator for success in the CL (ie winning it) as you can qualify and go onto win it from much lower, like PSG did.

Against Atletico we put out essentially a full strength first 11 and got 3 points but we do not have the strength in depth to do that twice a week and be competitive this season — there are holes in this squad that we are all aware of.

This should be a great opportunity for the fringe players like Koumas, Nyoni, Frimpong, Tsimikas, Chiesa, etc to be getting minutes and allowing us to rest the key players.

I would perhaps consider playing Wirtz to try and get his confidence hope by hoping he had a strong performance.

But I would be resting the other key players to ensure we're ready for Brentford.

I don't think pushing pre Christmas to try and finish top of the CL league is worth the trade-off. And we should be able to beat LASK with the squad players.

13 Oct 2026 15:30:03
Would this really boost Wirtz confidence if he is playing with a B string players?

13 Oct 2026 15:46:02
No game is easy with no CFs and a second choice winger. Koumas is fourth choice and will hopefully get there but a long way away from what we need currently.

13 Oct 2026 15:46:54
I would bring in Gomez for Jaquet. Frimpong for big Ron. Nyoni for Macca and Rio for Barcola. Keep the rest the same. i'd play Wirtz to give him a chance to get some confidence with the view of taking him out against Brentford if Szobo is fit.

13 Oct 2026 16:30:51
Marma, Frimpong, Araujo/Jacquet (45 mins each), Gomez, Tsimikas, Gravenberch, Nyoni, McConnell, Rio, Koumas, Barcola/Munoz (45 mins each).

Give Virg & Ali the night off.

13 Oct 2026 16:33:47
Chiesa isn't in the CL squad.

13 Oct 2026 18:40:00
Just play your best players and win the game. Forget rotating to lesser individuals. Play the best 11 available. We require momentum and need a dominant performance and victory to offset the City drubbing. And yes I do include Wirtz in there.

Even though he's been totally garbage so far, he will benefit from minutes on the pitch and so should we. Bring the squad players on if we're in command of the game and then only. My take.

{Ed025's Note - i expect Wirtz will excel against Lask SG, he is more suited to the European style of play which is slower and more methodical, this game could actually kickstart his season with a bit of luck mate..

13 Oct 2026 18:47:29
Andoni has previously said he will tone down significantly the training sessions at the AXA stadium to keep players fresh, similar to what was done yonks ago in the shankly era, when pre-season was basically all running/sprinting sessions, and match fitness was achieved by first friendly matches then the actual games for peak fitness.

It's all done (fitness) by science now, shanks just used to say to the players after a gruelling session, throw ye shirts on the table, then him and Sir Bob would pick them up and see how much sweat was on each of them, if you had minimal sweat on your shirt you would have to go round again, the hard way is always the best way to learn anything?

13 Oct 2026 19:38:22
For me

Alison
Frimpong
Gomez
Aurajo.
Kerkez
Gravenberch
Nyoni
Wirtz
Ngumoha
Koumas
Barcola.

13 Oct 2026 22:15:36
I'd probably go the same as that Red Jones now that I know Chiesa isn't in the squad and since Grav is suspended for the league anyway.

Id maybe go Marma just to not risk Ali getting one of his muscle injuries.

If Barcola and Wirtz can get off the mark against LASK it could be a boost for them.