05 Apr 2023 14:45:38
Post for Ed01 if possible please.

Based on what you've seen this season, how would you summarize the decline of our team this season?

It does seem to be a confusion of tactics, but does that come down to Pep L and his decisions proving he isn't good enough and Klopp giving him too much respect or is it Klopp who has run out of ideas and the team is washed out.

We all know a refresh is required and the age of the squad is a problem, but surely this can be accommodated to some extent, like a formation change or something?

I have thought before with the style we play if a 3-4-3 would be more suitable or even a 3-5-2, allowing TAA and Robbo to have the protection and ability to play a little higher without being scapegoated.

It is obviously we are needing a change and something has to happen so it would be great to get your two pence on this?

What would you change and where in your opinion are the changes needed?

Thanks.

{Ed001's Note - I think the only change we need is to go back to Klopp's way of playing that he brought in. It is not that he ran out of ideas, nor is the team washed out, it was just the mistake of trying to be too clever. Klopp thought there was a better way than his way, and there is with a different set of players, but not with the ones at the club. We need to go back to his plan A and if it is not working, then they should look to do plan A better. Instead we have tried to go to a way of playing that is not suited to the players, Klopp or the fans.

Lijnders needs to go. No assistant should be in the spotlight as much as he is, it creates the same confusion that nearly ended Paisley's managerial career early on. He is not even that good at what he does that he is worth mollifying with press conferences etc. He can take his oversized ego and lack of intensity with him and we can actually get back to Klopp being the sole man in charge. It suits Liverpool better to have a figurehead we can get behind. Liverpool and Klopp are a good match, Linders is just interfering and confusing things.

I certainly don't want a back 3, that is something that just allows centre-backs to pass over responsibility too easily. The formation was never the problem. The problem has solely come through trying to change things from what was working in an attempt to be more like City's way of playing. Just go back to being us. In your face, high energy and take the game to the opposition.}

1.) 05 Apr 2023
05 Apr 2023 15:46:06
Ed who would you say the players are who don't suit the new way we tried to play? Would you put it down to just the midfielders not being technically good enough or others too. Have to admit even when we were great under Jurgen i often wished we kept possession better like a City but didn't think we'd move away from what made us great in the first place to do it. I just thought that gradually Klopp would replace people with better players especially in d middle of the park.

{Ed001's Note - why would you want to play like City? It is tediously boring to watch them. And there is not one player we have other than Thiago who is truly suited to keep-ball.}

2.) 05 Apr 2023
05 Apr 2023 15:46:13
Totally agree with this. Ed- do you think going back to Klopps way of playing would hurt the progress of the likes of Elliot and Carvalho? Both seem like the are more suited to a Bruno Fernandez type role as they do not have the athletism to do the prime Hendo/ Gini box to box running/ pressing, nor do they have the explosive out to in runs/ goals that Mane, Salah and maybe Diaz have. Both seem to have good potential but I'd feel like at the very best they would still not be at Coutinhos level who even at his very best, was never really a Klopp player and we looked more balanced when he left. I know its not the biggest issue in the world for us but do you think they would hang around for the next evolution or be moved on/ kept squad players? I feel having Elliot, Trent and Mo covering the whole right hand side is a disaster when the opposition win the ball. A prime Hendo or Laimer/ Caciedo type player would bring much better balance to the Right side.

{Ed001's Note - I disagree completely on Elliott and Carvalho. They are much more suited to a high-press which would keep them right on top of the opposition and reduce the need for them to cover as much ground. They would be much further along if we had played that way, mainly because we wouldn't be in a mess with confidence destroyed. As for covering the right-side, we just need a centre-back who is able to defend, unlike Matip. Someone who actually reads the play and covers out there as he should do in that system. The midfield shouldn't really be dropping in to the full-back areas so much, they should drop in the middle while the centre-back goes out to engage. It is about reducing the distance needing to be covered. It is much easier for a centre-back to move out to the sides, than a central midfielder having to go back and sideways.}

3.) 05 Apr 2023
05 Apr 2023 16:09:59
As i understand it, the change in style was due to the ever changing / evolution of styles of play in football, and how much our previous style demanded of the players.
The stats/ graphs etc show City's way of playing to be much less heavy on the players. Footy is ever evolving. Think back to the boring days of italian domination and how defensive that was. Now new styles are being pioneered, and they are outdoing what we have been so good at.
I'm not convinced that there is a way back to where we were. Was the Utd 7-0 game the old style completely or has it been changed?

{Ed001's Note - our style demanded a lot of the players, but so does City's. In many respects defensively they play the same high-press system. The difference was down to the way we attacked more quickly and to not allow the opposition to settle.

Out team was not struggling, it was recruitment issues that were our problem, too many injury prone players sitting in the squad taking up a place. That was causing the higher demands on our players as the rest had to play extra minutes. Sort that out and there is no need for this idiotic keepball crap that is not even the same style as City's. It is some bastardised version of the old Dutch way of playing, that has failed to understand the Cruyffian principles it was based on. It was why Dutch football fell away from the top level, they thought tiki-taka was the ideal, when tiki-taka was what happened when Cruyff and Guardiola's style went wrong. It is exactly what both of them try so hard to avoid.}

4.) 05 Apr 2023
05 Apr 2023 16:12:24
Problem is Ed1, Lijnders ain’t going anywhere.

{Ed001's Note - then we are in trouble.}

5.) 05 Apr 2023
05 Apr 2023 16:13:59
I agree with you Ed1, but we don't have the players at this moment to play and maintain a high intensity game. Klopp should have known that his preferred style requires hungry young players and should have refreshed the team gradually. Now we face a massive rebuild, which means next year will be a transitonal one, as one poster has mentioned today.

{Ed001's Note - sorry but that is not true. You can play it with any players. Experienced players are often better at it because they have a better idea of when and where to press. What you need are players who are well coached and not lumbered with a constantly changing defence because it has been filled with injury prone players. Nothing to do with age, it should be refreshed to get rid of those who have fitness and attitude/ability issues.}

6.) 05 Apr 2023
05 Apr 2023 16:20:46
Ed, any chance of Lijnders leaving or being told to go? Thanks.

{Ed001's Note - I very much doubt it. Klopp clearly leans on him heavily.}

7.) 05 Apr 2023
05 Apr 2023 17:18:23
Hopefully konate can stay fit so because in fairness to Trent, Robbo and VVD (besides when T-Rex arms tried to end him) have been largely everpresent in their time here.

{Ed025's Note - you will be blaming pickford for all your players having bad attitudes and thinking they are all that next jude..

8.) 05 Apr 2023
05 Apr 2023 17:43:01
Well if that the case Ed1, Klopp might as well let him be the manager. Got the feeling if somehow magically Klopp demoted him and bring a new assistant, Pep will walk away.

9.) 05 Apr 2023
05 Apr 2023 17:52:03
Zeljko Buvac was Jurgens first coach when he was at Mainz, then Borussia Dortmund then LFC for circa 18 years in total, he was also Jurgens number two all that time, why Jurgen can't jettison Ljinders who was also an assistant to Buck Rodgers for not even half of Buvacs tenure is questionable.

Cannot think anything better than Milner as the new first team coach and assistant manager for next season.

Ferguson regularly changed his first team coaches Knox, Kidd, McClaren, Ryan, Queiroz, Walter Smith, Mike Phelan seven coaches in all, never done him any harm.

10.) 05 Apr 2023
05 Apr 2023 18:18:29
Pep and his big ideas seem to be getting carried away, although it's only really since the Intensity is our identity waffle that many have been on his back. I imagine its only really the Ed's and people who have inner contacts at the club that truly know how much of a problem Pep is.
Jurgen says he needs Pep's energy, which kind of makes sense, but letting him imagine new tactics and deciding who we should sign is another thing.
Apparently Gakpo was all Pep's idea, and doesn't look like a bad one thus far.


2 robust, strong CB's that can play a bit sound more and more essential.

11.) 05 Apr 2023
05 Apr 2023 18:19:37
Why are people still hell bent on blaming lijnders? at the end of the day we’ve been crap all season bar from a few games. Klopp has seen first hand how poor we are yet he’s changed nothing and keeps playing the same tripe week in and week out. His team selections are poor and his substitutions are shocking!
We aren’t going to have the clear out that we need to and we won’t buy players for all the positions needed.

Proper cover for Trent is needed
Gomez, Matip and Phillips need to move on ( Phillips more to kick start his career)
Milner is too old, Henderson is a shadow of the player he was, Thiago is too injury prone ( cracking player but doesn’t suit us), Jones unfortunately isn’t good enough. Thankfully kieta and ox are off.
Firmino has chose to leave and I wish him all the best, if the right offer comes in for jota I can’t see us turning it down. Does Klopp have the balls to cut those not good enough? I don’t think so as he’s too loyal. Would we get rid of all those players and the likes of Adrian? I don’t think we’d disrupt the team that much?

12.) 05 Apr 2023
05 Apr 2023 18:54:31
You can see just watching the game that passing the ball around ad nauseum doesn’t suit the player. It makes me cover my eyes when I see our defenders passing the ball around the back and that’s before we get to the midfield ?.
I agree, go back to what we used to do where we pressured players into mistakes. The day we purchased Thiago was the start of our “revolution” . It hasn’t worked.

13.) 05 Apr 2023
05 Apr 2023 18:55:44
100% agree with everything Ed01 has said as well as the poster who said about Klopp leaving if he doesn’t take back control and do things his way. definitely need to return to our previous winning style and if we’re not going to then Klopp might as well leave and let Pep take charge as well as take the criticism. I really hope it isn’t the latter but at least if that does happen Linders will be gone pretty swiftly because if he wasn’t hiding behind Klopp right now he’d already have been sacked.

14.) 05 Apr 2023
05 Apr 2023 19:22:40
Well the bigger worry then is that Klopp is not removing Pep if he so poor at his job, changing players won't matter if Klopp continues to let Pep make these decisions, poor by Klopp.

15.) 05 Apr 2023
05 Apr 2023 18:29:52
Just fact ed, Virg was imperious and everpresent till P#ickfords career highlight?.

{Ed025's Note - come on jude, it was a bad challenge but i still dont think he meant it mate it was just clumsy, now i know the reds are not having the best time of it at the moment but looking for scapegoats is never the way to go my friend..

16.) 05 Apr 2023
05 Apr 2023 19:39:26
Problem is regardless of whose ideas they are to do anything, Klopp will have the final say for them to be implemented.

17.) 05 Apr 2023
05 Apr 2023 19:51:16
Come on Forest. Interview Lijnders!h

18.) 05 Apr 2023
05 Apr 2023 20:02:24
Liverpool this season are not able to match opposition's change of intensity and physicality.
A midfield that's become full of crocks, tippy tappy style players and lightweight youngsters that aren't ready.
The mix is all wrong in my view.
I thought that at the season's beginning and still do.
You need a bit of everything and it's totally plain that this is not the case at present.

{Ed025's Note - it needs a rebuild juicer, im talking at least 4 players are needed to reinvigorate the squad and thats with quite a few going the other way, and im talking pretty big names mate maybe not jude but top quality, anything less and i can see you struggling next season...so over to you FSG..

19.) 05 Apr 2023
05 Apr 2023 20:43:43
I can’t wait for July - it’s going to be thrilling isn’t it?

20.) 05 Apr 2023
05 Apr 2023 18:49:11
Appreciate the detailed reply Ed.

I understand the standpoint there and agree, the recruitment of the likes of Diaz and Nunez show that he does want that hungry in your face style players who will track and run for the team. Work horses and desire for the game.

It does seem as though the issue lies down to Pep in many respects. Similar to a previous post about Buvac, Klopp does need to be ruthless and cut ties. He found success and Liverpool found success when it was him and his style and attitude.

I understand the point about fitness issues though but equally, our title winning run was maintained and we found the right balance, the likes of Gini W was able to play nearly every game and was a tank on the ball, not my favourite player at all, often one of the most frustrating, showed up for big games but he was always available and could work in that style of play we adapted and had brilliant success at.

I think some of the issues does come down to no medical dr currently, needing a new DoF and the issues looming over the clubs ownership or the recent statements from FSG. I can imagine it can have an impact on the players. Adding to that Pep’s silly tactics.

I remember you mentioned before that Klopp wanted to take more of a back seat so he can focus more on his family time while being the manager. Letting his coaches do the tactics and methods. But it doesn’t seem to work or fit with him. He is an all or nothing kind of character.

If and that’s a big if, Klopp we’re to go/ leave/ mutual/ sack. Would Nagelsmann be a good alternative that could fit within a Liverpool system, it he was available? I hope he doesn’t go to Chelsea as I can imagine it may ruin him… I would also consider Alonso as he seems to be doing rather well at managerial level so far, it might be too soon to see yet though….

{Ed001's Note - Nagelsmann looks a very good option but he showed at Bayern that he would very much need to be given more power. There was too much interference from above there weakening his position and allowing, in particular, the keeper to be a bigger and bigger problem. Once that was allowed to happen without Neuer being immediately sold, his position was untenable.}

21.) 05 Apr 2023
05 Apr 2023 19:05:00
Why do you think Klopp leans on Lijnders so much Ed001?

So strange how Klopp hasn't realised that the change in tactics isn't working, can't understand why he would want to stick with it after how bad we are every week.

{Ed001's Note - Lijnders talks a great game and is very highly regarded within football. No idea why. He showed in a stint as manager that he has no tactical clue at all. I think last season's results made him seem like a genius when we were all on here expressing concern about how we were getting results despite that change in approach.}

22.) 05 Apr 2023
05 Apr 2023 20:25:50
Get some pace, some aggression, some physicality and robustness for me Ed.
Liverpool were blowing everyone away a couple of seasons ago, now it's like watching walking bloody football lol.
Klopp is at his most effective when his gander is up, the juices are flowing and the crowd are energised.
It becomes the Anfield and the identity we all love.
Retire disgracefully, with the heavy metal blasting lol.

{Ed001's Note - spot on mate.}

23.) 05 Apr 2023
05 Apr 2023 22:30:10
I find City boring to watch too but id be shocked if any City fans did. I don't think anyone would find that playstyle boring if its your own team battering teams and winning titles for fun. I often think Bayern fans for example must be bored winning the title every year but if it was us in their position would we be?

24.) 05 Apr 2023
05 Apr 2023 22:34:10
I like that Juicer. Ganders and danders.

25.) 06 Apr 2023
06 Apr 2023 14:41:08
Ed01, you get an A for consistency. You have been saying these exact same things since October and thru out the podcasts. How Klopp agreed to this new way of playing when it was clear it was not working is beyond me BUT I can see why he continued with it cos he prolly saw the difficulties of it late lasst season (when we transitioned to it) and thought it could still work cos well we challenged and nearly won everything. Wrong BUT I can see why.

That is one of the several gambles (including not signing a stop gp midfielder knowing we needed one and not moving players like Oxx and Naby out) he took that have failed massively and that has done us in. Like you, I have NO desire to see us play like City in any way. Boring as heck and wouldn't immitate that team in any way if you paid me.

What made us the best team on the planet btw '17 and '20 was the high octane, swash-buckling, No F's given style of footie that terrorized the whole of England, Europe and the World. The players we have had over time were NEVER brought in to play possession footie so how anyone thought we could play it is also beyond me.

IMO; Pep will still be here cos Klopp LIKES working with him and has his ear so we just have to hope Klopp sees the light and retakes the reigns again like he did with Buvac. If not and we keep struggling next season, he will definitely leave.