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26 Jan 2019 20:38:40
Ed025, only this morning you stated that there were 3 CBs in every Premier League team (other than Liverpool) who are better than Dejan Lovren. After seeing the shambolic defending from set pieces by Everton in their match at Millwall this evening, it is blatantly obvious to me that Lovren is simply streets ahead of Keane, Mina, Zouma, Jagielka and any other CB on Everton’s books. Agree?

Wirral Wonder

{Ed025's Note - even though dejan is pathetic WW, i cant argue with what you are saying mate..

1.) 27 Jan 2019 07:38:23
Millwall play Karius in goal and you only manage 3 shots on target. Ouch ed25.

{Ed025's Note - tell me about it longthing, i cant even make excuses for that mate..

2.) 27 Jan 2019 08:58:08
That’s why we love yer eds25 win lose or draw your always fair and honest 👌🏻.

{Ed025's Note - cheers mate..

3.) 27 Jan 2019 09:30:33
Agree Longthing. Always humble Ed25 no matter what.

4.) 27 Jan 2019 10:55:14
Ed025 my favourite Ed
Banter yes- balanced viewyes- knowledgeable yes
Unfortunate with who he supports -yes.

{Ed025's Note - after yesterday your spot on agger..

5.) 27 Jan 2019 11:19:15
I listened to a phone in earlier in the week Ed- and done EFC fans were expressing they don’t see a pattern of how you play, or a set structure.
Is this the case?
Looking at the personnel available would be expecting you to be more consistent and higher placed

What’s the story?

{Ed025's Note - its just not working agger, our guys look like they have never played together before and dont understand zonal marking, i dont know what they do in training mate but whatever it is they need to change it..

6.) 27 Jan 2019 12:40:07
Patience running thin Ed025? Or do you want Silva there for the remainder of the season. maybe even another season?

Looking from the outside in, not sure how much he has improved compared to Allardyce.

7.) 27 Jan 2019 15:57:00
Ed25, I thought you were having a laugh when you said that 3 CB's in every PL team are better than Lovren. I propose you start with your own mob cos ALL your CB's are a complete joke. At least that just one team.

IMO, Lovs wil start at Arsenal (their CB's are atrocious), Utd and even Chelsea (Rudiger and Luiz are a calamity) . Again, that is just within the top 6. Did I also mention that Lovs shut down CR7 in the CL final one one one? Yeah, those are facts, bro. I can easily name many others for whom Lovren with the other 14 teams BUT I'll stop here cos I can feel your gritting teeth all the way from here.

{Ed025's Note - he is that bad that he would fit in well at everton brover, we need to have this discussion after the next couple of games mate and see how he acquits himself...provided klopp is desperate enough to pick him that is..

8.) 27 Jan 2019 18:25:22
Ed25, why are we having a discussion on whether Lovs is good enuff or not? He has been here for the past 5 seasons and is STILL here. Skrtel and Sahko who many thought were better than him, got binned at the first opportunity so If he was a "pathetic" as you say he is then what is he again, still doing here? Why did Klopp give him a new deal in 2017? Why did he have the season and WC he had if he was "pathetic"? Could it be cos he is as good as I think he is overall?

There is nothing to discuss here, my friend. You think he is useless. I disagree with using such extreme words to describe a very capable CB who on his day would put ALL of Everton's CB's combined into immediate unemployment. Did I mention he shut down CR7 in the CL, lol?

If he makes a mistake (like no other player in history has ever made a mistake) in the next two games should he play, it won't change my opinion. Why? Mistakes happen. Carra made tonnes of mistakes in his LFC career (led the PL all time in own goals) BUT you don't see me calling him pathetic, do you? BTW, Your CB's are just dreadful to the point that Zouma who I love as a CB, is getting worse under Silva. Take care mate.

{Ed025's Note - zouma is our best CB mate and hes not even ours..

9.) 28 Jan 2019 07:20:21
Lovren is not useless, he’s just unreliable.
Matip is useless 🤝.



20 Jan 2019 19:55:43
I was at the game yesterday and in all the excitement and tension of the final few minutes I missed a significant incident which I have only just seen on the Sky re-run of the full 90 minutes. Rafa Camacho came on at right back for the final 2 or 3 added on minutes. After Crystal Palace’s 3rd goal, they had one final attack and the ball was worked out to Wilfred Zaha inside the penalty area and one-on-one with Camacho. He took Camacho on on the outside, like he had done successfully a few times against Millie, including the 1st Palace goal. If he had got past, he would have been through with a chance to shoot or cross. Camacho stayed on his feet, won the ball, Van Aanholt put the loose ball well over the bar and the game was won. Camacho can rightfully claim to have played an important part in a vital win. Nice one Rafa.

Wirral Wonder

1.) 20 Jan 2019 21:22:50
I always prefer we play a youngster in his favoured position than shoe horn an experienced player into a position he’s not comfortable in.

2.) 20 Jan 2019 21:40:02
1985mikey - Camacho's not a right back. He's a winger that happens to be able to put a tackle in.

3.) 20 Jan 2019 21:40:53
Didn’t Camacho play up front for the 23s last week? Correct me if I’m wrong but I don’t think his favoured position is right back?

4.) 20 Jan 2019 21:41:04
Mikey, amazingly Camacho is actually a left winger predominantly!

Klopp has seen something in him as a right back though so fair play to him for repaying Klopp's faith so far.

5.) 20 Jan 2019 23:17:45
Some of the worlds best RBs would get done by zaha whem he is in the mood.

6.) 21 Jan 2019 03:38:19
Milner has played as a right back and right midfielder at various points in his career - I would hardly called it shoehorning him in. He had a mare though and got destroyed by Zaha who was himself excellent - glad Camacho was able to make a telling contribution, I think Klopp is mentioned it in one of his post-match interviews, so hopefully it gives the lad a boost.

7.) 21 Jan 2019 05:27:03
Neither Milner nor Fabinho are able to counter that type of pace if at RB.
Leicester pose a similar threat too, though Milner is likely to miss that game now.
I definitely don’t want to see Fabinho at RB in this league *shudders*.

8.) 21 Jan 2019 05:59:29
I think trent would be back for us against the foxes.

9.) 21 Jan 2019 09:10:51
Mikey, Camacho is a natural winger so there goes your shoehorning argument.

10.) 21 Jan 2019 15:42:03
Pace for a full back is key. Even if you get done once, blistering pace will give you another chance to make the tackle. Milner was always going to be vulnerable to Zahas pace but he’s so reliable you can understand Klopp’s decision. Hospital ball for the 2nd yellow ( from Fab I think) e.



04 Jan 2019 20:01:48
Good evening Ed01. I have only just read your response to a post earlier this morning in which you say that TAA was at fault for City's second goal and that he could do with extra coaching on the defensive side of his game. I actually thought that Lovren was at fault for lying a bit deep, playing Sterling onside when he received the pass from Danilo and allowing Sterling to run across our defence before slipping the ball to Sane, who was unmarked because TAA had no option but to go with Aguero's run into the box. I should stress that this is in no way an argumentative post, I am just a supporter with no coaching experience whatsoever, and I am genuinely interested to hear a bit more from someone with your coaching experience, knowledge and insight into just what TAA did wrong and how he can improve defensively. Cheers.

Wirral Wonder

{Ed001's Note - I did say Lovren was brought over and was out of position as well, but Trent, on a regular basis, allows himself to come in far too narrow on the cover and so leaves too much space out wide. A lot of the time I noticed yesterday that he was shouting for someone else to go out and close down Sane when it was his man.

What he should have done in the City goal was be a little further wide, to give himself a chance to get across. He just came across too far. It is something he is prone to doing, or, the other thing he does wrong is press too high up the pitch without checking there is cover. There is a real lack of awareness from him at times. With the goal he should have seen the threat was wide of him and positioned himself accordingly. Instead he concentrates on the ball and gets himself right in the centre of the pitch, where he was not really needed.

He has to trust Lovren can at least force the attacker to slow his pace or for Lovren to drive him wider or into making the pass like he did. City had two players wide of him that he had to get in position to close out. The central area he has to trust to the centre backs in that position as anyone going past Lovren is on top of Alisson then and Trent would only get in his way and block his view.

If you are going to play two deep lying midfielders in front of the backline, then the fullbacks have to stay wide at all times or people just get in each others way and leave too much space on the flanks.}

1.) 04 Jan 2019 21:14:36
Do you see TAA at full back long (er) term Ed?

{Ed002's Note - Sure.}

2.) 04 Jan 2019 21:16:25
Unfortunately Lovren was appalling and can't blame anyone for not trusting him. He’d already been booked for his usual rash challenge in first 25 mins which meant he was scared to put in a tackle for rest of match. His passing forward was so bad VVD didn’t want to pass to him as he knew Lovrens pass would go straight to a City player and they’d be straight through the midfield and onto our defence. Summed up by last kick of game when usually calm VVD went mental when Lovren played a straight pass over his head instead of going from an angle. Sterling should have had a third when Lovren mis kicked in penalty area after another mistimed tackle and he was left out of position and bypassed too easily on numerous occasions and he was arguably at fault for first goal. If he stays in the side and doesn’t find form and confidence I’m afraid we won’t win the league. And saying that we would go unbeaten for whole season.

3.) 04 Jan 2019 21:24:42
Ed01, you summed it up perfectly, When Sterling runs forward, Sane comes into view completely unmarked on the left and Sterling plays an easy pass, TAA is then in the box with Lovren.
As you say, if he had the awareness he would have been out wider putting pressure on Sane instead of standing on Lovrens toes, it was just too easy.
Lovren was not great last night but I don't think he was at fault for that goal. TAA is young and will learn from it.

4.) 04 Jan 2019 22:06:17
Ed01 is spot on. It is always easy to blame Lovs for even standing anywhere near where a goal is scored BUT people need to use their eyes and stop being selective in who they choose to bash. When Sterling plays the ball across. Aguero runs towards the center so Lovs has to go with him. TAA is already caught up field and out of position which allows Sane to cut in thru on goal and TAA arrives too late as Sane shoots and scores. Except people want Lovs to be Mr Fantastic who can stretch himself to cover a whole left side by himself, I don't know what people want from him.

TAA is susceptible to such things and he gets caught up field in the press a lot and before he can blink, there is not one in behind when the ball is played into the gap he leaves. Lovs/ Gomez has to get out there and then when the goal is scored, he gets the blame. TAA did the exact same thing at Chelsea where he followed Hazard too deep into midfield and got caught out with a one-two ball and Hazard gets in and scores. You can bash Lovs all you want BUT he cannot be in two places at the same time.

{Ed025's Note - he only has to be in one place mate...on the bench.. :)

5.) 04 Jan 2019 23:30:30
025 luv ya.

6.) 04 Jan 2019 23:40:59
TAA also at fault for the first goal, if he carried on his run he could of cut the cross out to augero instead he just stopped in his tracks which he also done on a few other occasions while the play was going on around him.

7.) 05 Jan 2019 01:48:31
TAA and Lovren didn’t play well together, end of.

I still think the main issue was we missed Gomez with his pace and read of the game, Lovren is much better against the larger physical players than players with pace and movement.

Having said that TAA’s biggest problem was leaving all the space behind him as he kept pushing too high, and agree with Ed perhaps two deep midfielders would have suited him better to allow one to push across to cover Sané.

8.) 04 Jan 2019 21:07:25
Ed. you put trust and Lovren in the same sentence. Please allow me the courtesy of pulling you on that comment 😇.

{Ed001's Note - yeah I know, but sometimes you have to mate. VVD was close enough to provide cover anyway (if I remember correctly), and Alisson is there behind him. Sometimes you have to take a chance and there were two men free out wide that Trent should have been closer to in order to stop what happened.}

9.) 04 Jan 2019 21:34:42
Ed01, many thanks for taking the time to provide such a comprehensive response, just what I was looking for. I get so fed up with so-called experts (pundits, commentators, journalists, etc) offering cliched opinion as ‘professional insight’ and it is refreshing to get the real thing on this site. I will watch TAA in a new light and will even impress my match-going mates with my new found insight into our defensive play. Incidentally, who do you regard as the ideal PL full back as the role model for TAA to learn from?

{Ed001's Note - sadly I don't think there is one right now. It would be going back and looking at someone like Rob Jones at his peak. The key though is his awareness, very few young players do have it any more as teams are almost always packed full of players who began as attackers and were not good enough so got moved backwards into defensive positions. The players who play in attack in kids teams are almost invariably those with the best technique (or biggest/strongest/fastest) which is all clubs seem to care about now. There is little real thought given to looking at the rest of the game.

You look at how the likes of George Graham would drill their players over and over until defending became automatic and then look at modern day teams whose backline is very rarely moving with the same fluidity and organisation. The game has become unbalanced towards attacking play and technique and away from defensive organisation.

I would have him watching Henderson to be honest. Watch how he is constantly looking around him to see where everyone is. When you watch Trent he does not look around him at all and, like Lovren on the first goal, he does not get his body shape right to see them. If he is not even going to notice when a player is behind him, then no amount of watching videos will help him! He has to first be looking around to notice them, then, when he has done so, he can position himself better.

Lovren needs to do more to help him as well, to be fair. Lovren is an experienced centre back who should be screaming at Trent to tell him what is behind him.}

10.) 05 Jan 2019 10:45:48
Ball watching is one of the worst things a defender can do. I love TAA but he does ball watch a lot.

11.) 05 Jan 2019 11:30:40
Trent is a young centre mid making a huge step up to right full in a top team

I honestly see the issue with lovren it was against United last season when lukaku bullied him and rashford ran Trent into the ground

Lovren just doesn't communicate to the full backs he just isn't good enough he is almost good enough but costs us big games and big goals

Id sell in the summer and get someone else with Gomez our main right sided centre half.

12.) 05 Jan 2019 13:11:21
Communication in a defence is KEY to any good defence. If they are not talking to each other then it is not going to matter who you have back there. It will be a crap show. Lovs needs to be more demanding of TAA going forward as VVD is of Robertson who gets a dress down from VVD when he screws up.

I agree with Ed01 that TAA needs to be reeled in a little bit cos in big games, he clearly goes walk-about and then leaves gaps in behind, leaving Lovs or Gomez with an impossible task when we lose the ball. And for people saying Gomez this or Gomez that, I propose you go watch the Chelsea game where TAA does the EXACT same thing and Hazard is in and scores. Gomez like Lovs was vs City, were in an impossible position so if you think Gomez will fix TAA's penchant for going walk-about then you are fooling yourselves. Can Lovs do more? Of course he can and Ed has alluded to it BUT to say that Gomez will suddenly be Superman and cover a whole right side when he has two players to pick up, is ludicrous. Blaming Lovs for TAA's inherent issues is unfair and ridiculous, IMO.

13.) 05 Jan 2019 12:44:41
I'd like to see Liverpool spend big on a really top right-back to take the pressure off Trent. He's still young to be given so much responsibility. Ed001 mate are there any out there that you rate highly and you would want?

{Ed001's Note - only Wan-Bissaka and he is just as young and raw as Trent.}

14.) 05 Jan 2019 23:22:06
In The games I’ve watched them play together live this season Lovren and Trent have been a constant liability.

Many a time Alisson has bailed them out or the opposition haven’t been good enough to take advantage. Take Man U for example, every attack they had came from that side but they were only good enough to score on the occasion Alisson couldn’t bail them out.
They are a big weakness and opposition managers know this because they target them.

Lovren goes to pieces when he isn’t facing the opponents goal. So turn him round, get him facing his goal or the sideline and he is out of his depth.

Trent is just not good enough defensively, he’s a classical attacking wing back.

Most opponents are not good enough to take advantage but you can’t give Aguero the space he had because he is world class, the best finisher in the premier league in the last 10yr, and he WILL score.



30 Dec 2018 00:07:52
Ed01, more evidence of truly appalling refereeing in the PL today. A Brighton player scored against Everton from an offside position but the referee gave the goal as he saw the ball rebound to the Brighton player off an Everton player. This is an extract from the FA website under "Laws of the game and FA rules : Law 11 Offside" :

A player in an offside position receiving the ball from an opponent who deliberately plays the ball (except from a deliberate save by any opponent) is not considered to have gained an advantage.

In this incident, the Everton player did not deliberately play the ball to the Brighton player, it just bounced off him. That was why the Sane goal in the 2nd leg of last season's ECL tie between Liverpool and Man City was disallowed - the ball rebounded to him off Millie when he was standing in an offside position, Millie didn't deliberately play the ball to him. European referees know the laws, why don't PL referees?

There is a poster who is a qualified referee, perhaps he/ she has a view.

Wirral Wonder

{Ed001's Note - no you are wrong. The ref in the Brighton game is right as the ball only went FORWARD (which is the key bit) because it hit an Everton player. You can't be offside unless the ball is passed forwards. So the deflection off Gueye was a bit of luck for the Seagulls.}

1.) 30 Dec 2018 09:31:57
Not seen the incident. But ed001 you are wrong. The bank doesn’t need to be played forward. This is a general myth amongst the fans. You can be offside from a pass/ knock played in any direction.

2.) 30 Dec 2018 10:50:30
Benny, thanks mate. I was beginning to think I was misreading the laws of the game. Try and get a look at the incident in the Brighton v Everton game where the Brighton player was in an offside position, the Everton player was facing his own goal and the ball ricocheted off his shins to the Brighton player who put it in the goal. I think that, like me, others would value your opinion.

3.) 30 Dec 2018 11:36:04
Hey BB, good to see you around and chipping in. Hope to get your insight on this matter.

Also, wondering how's your training coming along? Oh, and will VAR be part of your training too?

4.) 30 Dec 2018 11:45:53
You can't be offside from a corner and the initial ball from the Brighton player was a corner which was then knocked by an Everton player on the penalty spot back into the 6 yard box. It doesn't matter if he meant it because Locadia was never offside.

5.) 30 Dec 2018 12:13:26
Mk summed it up for me bud. There’s no decision to be made. My post explaining the situation is on the others page. The linesman put his flag up because he didn’t know who the ball came off. So it was a safety net flag. The ref explained it came off an Everton player, and no problem.

6.) 30 Dec 2018 14:30:59
But when the Brighton player played the ball from the corner no one was offside. It ricocheted unfortunately, but it still didn't mean he was offside. It was a bit like Firmino’s first goal yesterday (not sure if he was in an offside position, just thinking more of the ricochet) or when Tottenham scored against Everton as well, from the Pickford/ Zouma debacle. Just because the opposition player was in an offside position, doesn’t mean he is offside.



06 Dec 2018 22:58:39
I have just read a report of a post match interview with the Burnley manager in which he called Daniel Sturridge a ‘cheat’ and said he ‘went down with no one near him’ to win a free kick. This from a manager with Ashley ‘Don’t breathe on me from behind or I will fall over’ Barnes in his team! What a two-faced so-and-so.

Wirral Wonder

1.) 07 Dec 2018 04:41:48
Two wrongs don’t make a right mate. Sturridge clearly dived and it was disgraceful.

2.) 07 Dec 2018 05:00:32
To be honest he did go down without contact, from what I saw in the replay.

3.) 07 Dec 2018 05:56:40
I mean he didn’t say anything wrong. I love Klopp but he was wrong imo. The game is physical. Sometimes bad challenges happen. Sometimes good challenges cause injuries. But we can all agree that losing because of a dive is the worst. (Not saying Burnley lost because of a dive, just making the point) .

4.) 07 Dec 2018 06:50:13
Burnley clearly had a plan to upset us with hard tackles. I don't necessarily think it's wrong but its dangerous the way they were sliding around in the first half.

5.) 07 Dec 2018 07:14:51
Dyche is under pressure. Managers will say a lot of stupid things but they get worse when they’re under pressure.

6.) 07 Dec 2018 07:37:35
Yeah exactly Ron, Jose is in the same boat.

7.) 07 Dec 2018 08:21:42
I wasn’t making any comment on whether Sturridge dived or not, or whether the Burnley tackling was out of order or not. I was pointing out the sheer hypocrisy of the Burnley manager criticising a Liverpool player for doing the same as at least one of his own players.

8.) 07 Dec 2018 09:10:38
Sturridge dived for the first free kick, not the second he was clearly pulled back, saying that the first free kick if sturridge left his left leg there it was getting whacked so its an odd one, you can see it from both points of view and with what Wirral was actually stating Dyche can't complain when his front men realised they couldn't bully Matip or VVD so decided to drop to the floor in hope of a free kick all the time.

9.) 07 Dec 2018 13:49:22
So often you hear people say that players have to go down to show they’ve been fouled because the refs don't give free kicks or pens unless they do, a lot of the time. I’d like to think that the ref realised that was the case, in this instance and that's why he gave the free kick because clearly, if he stood there, he’d have been booted over anyway. It’s not a dive to avoid what would otherwise be an obvious foul.

The trouble with Sturridge, like ed said, is that he does it too much and so the times that it’s a fair challenge he’s never going to keep the ball as he’s already moved out of the way. I like Sturridge a lot, but his game is based on jinking around players and drawing fouls, not getting stuck in when that extra bit of courage can cause loose balls and uncertainty in the defence.




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16 Feb 2019 11:22:12
Ed02, thanks for the reply. I happily admit I have only a rudimentary understanding of the rules despite you spending a lot of your time on this site explaining them to simpletons like me. But from that limited understanding they do seem to me be rather contradictory and geared towards the money-making activities of agents and others who inhabit professional football. One man’s deal making actions are another man’s tapping up activities .

Wirral Wonder

{Ed002's Note - Agents are covered by very restive rules and it is now heading back to the more struck rules of full registration. But you have to remember that agents are contacting Liverpool about players to discuss them and in most cases that is how transfers work. The players will likely be written to and reminded of their responsibilities - that is the norm. Where clubs have encouraged players to do it it is more serious - Barcelona has had trouble in the past with that.}



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16 Feb 2019 10:43:18
An agent can hawk his player around to various clubs but the player’s club can do nothing about it. Players from one club can talk to the media about wanting their mate from another club to join them and the mate’s club can do nothing about it. If a club make overtures to a player from another club without that club’s permission it is tapping up and forbidden. Doesn’t this demonstrate that the rules surrounding tapping up are out of date and ineffective and need an overhaul?

Wirral Wonder

{Ed002's Note - It is the job of the agent to talk to clubs about players. Players are not allowed to say they will be tapping up players on behalf of their club - Gerrard was caught doing that and admonished. If the media were to ask a player about another there would not be an issue them saying that it would be good if he joined - that would be fine. Klopp briefed members of the media over four players he wanted in an attempt to have them help him with his tapping up - although not covered in the rules it is unsportsmanlike. Maybe you don't have a clear understanding of the rules?}



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29 Jan 2019 10:45:56
For goodness sake, we are Liverpool, we are top of the Premier League, we are playing at home, it’s Leicester not Barcelona, they have lost 9 out of 23 Premier League games, we have got 29 points more then them - and they have got Wes Morgan and Harry Maguire in central
defence! Get a grip lads and have some faith in our manager and his squad.

Wirral Wonder



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16 Jan 2019 19:37:09
I despair of posters who give such nonsense even a second’s thought. In what parallel universe would we help out a major competitor by selling/ loaning them one of our players?

Wirral Wonder



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15 Jan 2019 14:28:52
Absolutely no need for panic chaps. We can still put out a strong defence/ midfield against Crystal Palace :


Milner Matip VVD Robbo

Fab Hendo

Shaq Bobby Sadio


Wirral Wonder




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16 Feb 2019 18:32:35
Ed01, I was reading an interview with Pep Lijnders on the LFC website earlier today. Pep says that when looking at potential players for Liverpool, character and attitude come even before talent. I wouldn’t dream of claiming to know more than you about Ozil’s ability, talent and even his work rate but do you think he still has the character and attitude to be a useful member of the Liverpool squad? For what it’s worth, in my opinion he doesn’t.

Wirral Wonder

{Ed001's Note - no idea.}



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16 Feb 2019 10:33:52
Jonesred, I am struggling to see anything in Ozil’s game that makes you think he fits Klopp’s style perfectly. Perhaps you could explain please?

Wirral Wonder



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16 Feb 2019 10:03:22
007, that is a very good ‘cut and paste’ job from the New Balance ‘This Means More’ campaign launch video from April 2018. Careful Bond or your next deadly enemy will be the New Balance copyright lawyers.

Wirral Wonder



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11 Feb 2019 19:17:43
RedWolf, written with your usual passion but please take the time to read what I actually posted which was definitely not a defence of Carra’s actions which I described as disgusting, stupid and vile.

Wirral Wonder



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11 Feb 2019 18:39:06
Ed025, I know you like having a go at me (was it something I posted about Gomes? ) but please read my post carefully again. I was making a general point about stress and mental illness, not trying to excuse Carra on the basis of a mental illness. What do I or you or anyone else know about the state of another person’s mental health? That was my point. And as neither you nor I nor anyone else was in the car with Carra we don’t know what he did or didn’t see. I was simply stating what I understand to have happened based on media reports at the time. We can all make up our own mind about what actually happened as you clearly have.
Not everything that happens in the world is black and white.
And Gomes is still slow and overweight.

Wirral Wonder

{Ed025's Note - i dont have a go at you WW your one of the best posters on here, but that does come across as making excuses for him because hes an ex-red mate, would you be saying the same thing if it was gary neville who had committed that vile act? .....i dont think so..