16 Jul 2018 08:59:13
A different take on the GK situation.

A number of posters have said, over the last few weeks, that if we can't get a significant improvement over our existing goalkeepers (i. e. Oblak or Alisson) then we shouldn't bother.

I disagree. David Brailsford (cycling supremo) firmly believes in the theory of marginal gains, as do I.

Basically, improving one thing by 100% is infinitely harder than improving 100 things by 1% - marginal gains.

Applying it to football, look at, for example, the difference that Arsene Wenger brought to the EPL when focusing on players diets (amongst other things) in the late 1990s. He won 2 doubles in his first 6 seasons and then went undefeated in 2003-4. There's a whole load of other factors involved too, but his approach revolutionised the EPL approach to diet and fitness.

Likewise, Klopp with his approach to fitness and the constant press.

So what's this got to do with our keeper conundrum?

We may not be able to get Alisson or Oblak (or De Gea or Courtois for that matter), but I would like to see an improvement in our goalkeeping capability. Even if its only 1%.

That 1% could be the difference between winning the league or not.

1.) 16 Jul 2018
16 Jul 2018 09:23:30
I think you've misunderstood a lot of people's argument Zed. The argument is that perception of Karius's ability has been massively colored by one concussed performance and that he has been very strong for us for most of last year. It's not that if we can't improve on him with a top quality keeper we shouldn't try at all, it's that most of the secondary quality keepers are not improvements at all - Navas, Clissen, Butland, Leno etc range between 'as good' and 'a bit worse'.

2.) 16 Jul 2018
16 Jul 2018 09:25:56
Trouble is you don't go paying £30 plus million for a 1% upgrade. And who's to say Karius hasn't the potential to improve himself by more than that over this coming season alone?

3.) 16 Jul 2018
16 Jul 2018 09:29:56
I agree with you - Zeddicus.

Trent better than Clyne.
VVD better than Matip.
Robertson better than Moreno.
Fabinho better than Can.
Keita better than Gini.

In the last year we have improved lots of areas. We just need the final push. Fekir and a keeper.

4.) 16 Jul 2018
16 Jul 2018 09:35:09
All I know is that Courtois goes to Madrid, Alisson to Chelsea and either Cillessen or Navas to us, we’ve metaphorically settled for the fat asthmatic kid who’s rubbish at football.

5.) 16 Jul 2018
16 Jul 2018 09:40:08
I think there's more than Karius's ability between the sticks at question, its the knock on affect of how the defence hasn't any confidence in the man behind them, which changes their decision making a lot, its surprising how having a calming figure behind you can lift a defenders game.

6.) 16 Jul 2018
16 Jul 2018 11:06:10
Agree with Flash. Gains like diet don't cost the club 10s of millions for minimum gains. Taking a ' slightly better than what we have ' approach will be expensive for potentially very little gain.

7.) 16 Jul 2018
16 Jul 2018 11:36:50
If we're talking marginal gains then maybe a look at replacing the goalkeeping coach should be considered as you could argue none of the keepers bought have improved to any great degree. Maybe replacing JA would achieve the gains required rather than spending sqillions of pounds on another stab at perceived excellence.

8.) 16 Jul 2018
16 Jul 2018 12:56:12
We’d better watch for Spurs and Utd getting new keepers then Lancaster. I mean how can their defences be confident in them after Lloris did exactly what Karius did only this time in a World Cup final and De Gea made the worst keeping mistake I saw at the World Cup when he threw one in in Spain’s first game.
All keepers have bad days and all make mistakes it’s how they come back from it that’s important. Karius just hasn’t had a chance to ‘get back on the horse’ yet but when he does I wish him all the best.

9.) 16 Jul 2018
16 Jul 2018 13:05:31
“we’ve metaphorically settled for the fat asthmatic kid who’s rubbish at football”

So in Navas case that’s a guy who has been number 1 at one of the biggest clubs in world football for a number of years, has been in goal for three successive champions league wins and won a league title.

Sorry but you don’t have that record if your garbage.

I am not saying by any means he is a perfect keeper, he isn’t (and has many flaws) , but let’s keep some perspective eh.

10.) 16 Jul 2018
16 Jul 2018 13:40:40
I tried that argument yesterday Wassa-lfc but got shot down.

11.) 16 Jul 2018
16 Jul 2018 15:42:48
John O'Shea made 71 champions league appereances, winning it once and winning the league 5 times. Wes Brown made slightly less, but won it twice and won the league 7 times. Football is a team game, and Navas isn't an amateur - but then neither are Karius, Mings and Ward. His trophy cabinet doesn't make him a quality footballer though.

12.) 16 Jul 2018
16 Jul 2018 16:18:54
Those mistakes came at international level not with the team on a weekly basis, those 2 keepers have a high consistency level and can keep their teams in matches if not win them, Karius has kept us in maybe 2 games since he signed, had a chance when he first came, got dropped for not being "ready", came back in and didn't set the world alight and only stayed in because we had nothing better (even though Ward was about), has started pre season poorly and already is getting heckled, hopefully Navas doesn't come in and if we don't anyone in, which will be a huge mistake I hope Ward does finally get his chance.